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  #1  
Old 05-14-2006, 04:12 AM
Chris Meyer Chris Meyer is offline
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Thumbs down NCCA show in Mystic, CT

Greetings,

I just attended the Northeast Cutlery Collectors annual show in Mystic, CT yesterday (Saturday, May 13, 2006). NCCA show. I was really looking forward to this show, but I must say that I was quite disappointed. This show seems to get worse every year. It was much better (and closer for me) when it was in East Windsor, CT.

The Mystic area has some interesting attractions (Seaport, Aquarium, etc.) but it?s still too early in the year to expect good weather, which they didn?t have. (It rained all day.) Also, I can't imagine who thought it would be a good idea to have the show on Mother's Day weekend. How many married guys (with kids) could expect to attend on Sunday without ending up in the dog house?

On to the show itself. To start with, the NCCA claimed that they would have 100 tables. There may have been a hundred tables in the entire hotel, but I don't think there were anywhere near that many being used for knives. There certainly were nowhere near 100 knifemakers/sellers with tables. I don't know if the Mystic Hilton has any large conference rooms, but the NCCA certainly didn't get any. They had the show in two relatively small rooms that were across the hall from each other. The tables that they did have were squeezed in so tightly that there was very little room to pass down the aisles. Granted, I am not svelte, but there was not enough room for two way traffic through the aisles. Several times I had to wait, or go around, because invariably a couple of oblivious patrons would stop in an aisle and start gabbing. This annoyed me, and I saw some of the vendors getting mad as well because people couldn't get to their tables.

I would estimate that there were less than ten custom knife makers with table at the show. Herb Derr was there with a whole table full of knives, but some of the others only had a handful of knives on display. One well known maker, who is a very nice guy (I don?t mean to disparage him so I won't mention his name), had only one small knife on his table, and I was there at 1300hrs on the first day of the show. He may well have sold a ton of knives before I got there, but I was disappointed that I didn't see more of his blades.

Of course the show wasn't all bad. I did get a chance to see tick-tock (sp?) from the forums and check out his knives. He really gets some nice hamons on his blades. Chris Kravitt of Treestump leather was there and had a nice display of sheaths, and even a photo book with some of his other work. There were some nice displays of Randalls, Queen folders, and some other old brands. One vendor (I think it was Rene Roy's table) had a large selection of stag and nice bone for handles.

Unfortunately, much of the rest were tables with the obligatory piles of old, junky, over priced, knives. I saw one knife for sale that I recognized as one of those old Carver Hall bowies. Someone had (poorly) etched the Marine Corps emblem on the blade and it was being offered for sale as a commemorative Marine Corps bowie. If I recall correctly, they were asking $400 for it! One table had some of Robert Hunt's books about Randall knives, apparently for sale. I was interested in buying a book but no one was manning the table. I stood around the table for a few minutes waiting for the seller (who may have been Mr. Hunt) but know one ever showed up. I finally gave up and left.

Start to finish, it only took me 30 minutes to walk around the whole show, and that includes the time that I was delayed by obstructed aisles. I used to really enjoy the NCAA shows, but I doubt I'll attend one again.


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  #2  
Old 05-14-2006, 07:17 PM
Sam Wereb Sam Wereb is offline
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I'm sorry to see a show decline, but it is nice to get an honest review - one that is actually readable. I'd rather see this than a posed shot with the promoter and read "A good time was had by all."

You took us right to the show, such as it was. Well done, Chris.

Did you see the knife they were to raffle?

Last edited by Sam Wereb; 05-14-2006 at 07:45 PM.
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  #3  
Old 05-14-2006, 07:34 PM
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SharpByCoop SharpByCoop is offline
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I could not make it because of a schedule conflict with my coaching, and, as you allowed, Mother's Day.. The NCCA show will never be an NYC-type show, nor does it bill itself as mostly customs. It has always had a larger percentage of non-custom tables.

You don't need to have a custom maker there to enjoy good, I mean REALLY good, customs. Knifemasters (Jack Feder) and KnifeLegends.com (Paul Shindler and John Hanlon) were both there with their tables set up.

You will not find a more varied and valuable set of makers represented on each of their tables. I think I could spend easily 30 mins with each one exploring more about the different makers they represent. I think you may have missed out on some good learning opportunities.

You might have found some of those missing knives from whomever being displayed on their tables. Not unusual.

I don't remember this two-day show being in East Windsor. Just Stamford. You must go back well before I started going. I know they had two single-day EW shows in the last 8 mos, though.

Coop


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Old 05-14-2006, 09:10 PM
Chris Meyer Chris Meyer is offline
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Sam,

They had four knives available in their auction. They were all fairly small knives (not that that really matters). One of the knives donated was by Jim Siska; I didn't recognize the makers of the others. I bought a ticket, but I seldom have luck with such things.


Coop,

I am quite happy to see vendors with an assortment of custom maker's knives on their tables. It makes it easy for me to see a variety of work and even compare makers. In Mystic, there were in fact a few sellers with a nice selection of quality handmade knives on their tables. I certainly did see some very nice knives on those tables, but those tables were the exception at this show. Also, as I mentioned in my review, there were some inconsiderate people blocking the aisles, and others monopolizing the view at certain tables. I ended up skipping some tables just because I couldn't get to them. Since I was just looking and not buying, I didn't want to be equally rude and tell them to get the hell out of the way.

As far as the NCCA show not being on par with bigger shows, I take that into account. However, in my opinion, the NCCA's annual show has declined over the years, starting with the move to Stamford. They had the two day show in East Windsor for years, and then they moved it to Middletown for one year. I rented a table at that show and, while I didn't do well, I thought the show was pretty good. The first year in Stamford I drove through a monsoon to get there and was not impressed when I arrived.

In the past I used to see makers such as JD Smith, Jason Williams, Bill McHenry, Gerry Jean, Norm Bardsley, John MacDonald, Paul Jarvis, and A.J. Hubbard (now deceased). Now the only one who seems to regularly attend is Jim Siska. I am not criticizing the makers. I assume that they would continue to show up if they were getting a decent return on their investment of time and money. I am not really even criticizing the people running the shows, although I do think the move to Stamford was a mistake. Why bother attending CT’s little show if you are that close to NYC already? There are certainly bigger and better shows in NY City. When they were in East Windsor, CT they had a decent sized facility, centrally located in the state, with easy access to I-84. I think that made the show more attractive to the makers and the patrons.

The NCCA’s annual show is not the only show in trouble either. About 10 years ago I attended the East Coast Custom Knife Show (I don’t recall the exact year, but it was at the New Jersey Meadowlands.) That was a fantastic show. My buddy Darrin and I got to see an enormous number of handmade knives and we met some top notch makers; like Dan Winkler, Harvey Dean, and the Warenskis. The facility was beautiful, the people were friendly, and a great time was had by all.

In contrast, Darrin and I attended the 2005 ECCKS and were very disappointed. This time the show was in New York City at a hotel across from Carnegie Hall. We managed to park and find the hotel without too much difficulty. Unfortunately, the show was in the cramped bowels of the hotel. You entered the show from a mezzanine with some vendors crammed onto it, and then descended to the main room which looked like a sub-basement to me. There were some very good makers in attendance, but in nowhere near the numbers as the earlier show. To make an already long story short, we were quite disappointed. The 2005 show was simply not up to the same standards as the Meadowlands show. After that, I don’t intend to attend another ECCKS.

I don’t know what the answer to these poor showings is. Perhaps there are simply too many shows and the knifemaking/buying community is being spread too thin. I do know that one unimpressive afternoon can sour a patron on a show and make them reluctant to return.

Of course, these are just my observations and opinions. You are free to agree or disagree.


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Last edited by Chris Meyer; 05-14-2006 at 09:14 PM.
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Old 05-14-2006, 09:21 PM
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This is the one NCCA show that I havent done. But I've gone to every one. I think Mystic was a good idea but I think they should do stamford too.
Two room shows always seem strange to me, but the flow wasnt too bad.
Thing you got to remember is that this is a "club" show and not a custom show so there will never be as many makers as say NY.
There were some great dealers there...like Coop says...and they had some sweet knives.
One guy had som great bowies....a beutiful Jim Jackson piece that I got to "coon finger" and a stunning damascus Bowie...can't remember who's.....but WOW....it sure did float my boat. Very inspiring.

Mace


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Old 05-15-2006, 01:00 PM
ChiefRI ChiefRI is offline
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This weekend was also the auto flea market at Tweeter Center in Mansfield, MA. I mention this because they are able to get that venue because it is mothers day weekend. I'm sure that's the story with the NCCA. Table/aisle spacing has been a problem in the few knife shows that I have attended, this was no different. That said, I saw some interesting stuff, bought a discounted Benchmade, and got my $6 worth.
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Old 05-16-2006, 04:03 PM
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I think that there are a few things that need clearing up.

The NCCA show used to be in Waterbury Ct, then it moved to Stamford.
The mystic show had far more than 10 knifemakers, to just name a few there was

Jim Siska
Rene Roy
Kelly Carlson
Lamont Coombs
Stephen Olszewski
Norman Bardsley
Howard Hitchmough
Dave AKA tic tock
Ray Smith MS
Herb Derr

This year's EECKS show was held at the Crown Plaza hotel at times square.

The Ny Custom knife show was held at the park central hotel and yes it was in a terrible location.

There probally less makers at the show than you would have hoped because of a few reasons.
1. It was mothers day weekend
2. The new location might have been further than some makers wanted to travel with gas prices the way they are.
3. The blade show is 1 month away. I didn't have a table for that very reason, I don't have enough knives!!
4. Some makers you mentioned like J.D. Smith, Bill McHenry and Jason Williams don't make that many knives anymore. I haven't seen J.D. Since the Blade show last year and I can't remember the last time I saw Jason or Bill with knives for sale, or have a table for that matter.

The other thing is that there are so many more shows, almost one every weekend.
People don't have to go to shows to buy knives, the internet is the cause of that.

Sorry you were disapointed with the show, but it was a good way to spend a rainy day!


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  #8  
Old 05-17-2006, 03:19 AM
Chris Meyer Chris Meyer is offline
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striper28,

You seemed to agree with me on nearly every point, so what is it that you were clearing up. My most egregious error seems to be saying that one of the previous shows was in Middletown when it was apparently in Wallingford, CT. I had a table at the show, my brother came and visited me there, and he lived in Middletown at the time and said the hotel was near his house. Recalling that information, I assumed that the hotel was in Middletown. Since you seem to remember more clearly, I will concede the point to you.

I estimated that there were less than 10 custom makers at the show. You claim that there were far more than that, but you only listed 10 makers. Who are the others? I mentioned that Rene Roy was there, however, I did not realize that he was a maker. If there were "far more" makers than you listed, they certainly weren't attending their tables while I was there.

I attended the ECCKS (ECCKS), not the NY Knife Show. The show was at the Crowne Plaza Hotel, Times Square, 1605 Broadway
New York, New York. There is a sign for Carnegie Hall on a building across the street from the hotel. I don't know NYC, so if that's not actually Carnegie Hall, as you seem to be insinuating, I don't know why the sign is there. As for the Crowne Plaza Hotel, I thought the basement rooms were lousy. I can't tell you about the other hotel you mentioned because I have never been there.

As for the makers I mentioned, they have in fact attended previous NCCA shows, so I'm not sure what your point was. One of the makers I listed is dead (as I pointed out) so I obviously wasn't saying that I expected all of the makers I named to show up every year. I haven't seen Jason since a show in Providence, RI several years ago. I saw J.D. at the Ashokan seminar in 2004 and he mentioned that he's no longer a full time maker. I do not know what the other people I mentioned are up to these days but perhaps some of them would attend the NCCA show if the venue was better.

You agreed that running the show on Mother's Day weekend was probably a mistake, that the location was perhaps too far away for some makers, and that there may be too many shows going on each year. About the only thing of substance that we disagreed on was whether or not the show was a good was to spend a rainy day. You thought it was; I thought it was a waste of my time. As I mentioned in a previous post, everyone is free to agree or disagree with my opinions.


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Old 05-17-2006, 10:44 AM
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Chris,
I'm not trying to get into it with you I'm just stating my opinion as you are.

The NCCA shows, no matter where they have been have always been rusty pocket knife shows. The custom makers kinda trickled in but they will always be rusty pocket knife shows. So unfortunately they attract rusty pocket knife collectors, not custom collectors.

$85 for a table for 2 days is cheap for a knife show and it gets your face and name out there.
If you think that it was a waste of your time then don't go back. Stephen Olszewski was there and the 3 knives he had available were priced from $3500-4500. Do you think it was a waste of his time to be there since there probally would not be any big spenders there?

Do larger, more well known shows. The EECKS is now at the Crown plaza, for the March shows and the Tables are $650 if you can get in.

Bill And Jason are no longer making knives, so no matter how good the venue is you will not see them there.

I still think that you have the 2 hotels mixed up. This is the show that was in the basement. It also had vendors cramped into the second level when you walked in.
Mar. 4-6 2005
East Coast Custom Knife Show, New York, NY
Park Central Hotel, 870 Seventh Ave. (at 56th St.)
Fri. 1-7, Sat. 9:30-6, Sun. 9:30-4

Carnegie hall 57th Street & 7th Avenue

The Crown plaza has their show rooms on the 2nd floor.

Good luck with your knifemaking career.


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Last edited by striper28; 05-17-2006 at 10:54 AM.
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Old 05-17-2006, 02:50 PM
Chris Meyer Chris Meyer is offline
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striper28,

I like that term, "rusty pocket knife show". I'll have to start using that one. I guess I'll have to stick to the larger shows if I want to see the kind of knives that really interest me (but that I can't afford). Have a nice day.


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Old 05-21-2006, 08:54 PM
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Ncca Mystic Ct Knife Show

Chris,
I find it interesting, reading your review of our show; it seems that you have missed the concept behind knife collecting in general. First, the show has never been in Wallingford or Middleton. 15 years ago we left East Windsor, went to Waterbury, then Stamford, now our annual show is in Mystic. Everyone who works on that show volunteers, I will repeat myself, volunteers. We welcome suggestions, and we would welcome anyone who would volunteer to work on promotions and advertising and other things that go along with putting on a good knife show. We, the NCCA, put this show on for our members, and many of our members are "rusty" old pocketknife collectors who have some pretty fantastic old Civil War bowies and pre Civil War factory pocket knives. We had displays of old pocket knives last weekend that were well worth over $50, 00 just for what was "on display".
Never mind the current living custom makers who attended, you must have missed the Scagels for sale, or the Morans and I know there were a few nice old Springfield Randalls in both ballrooms.
I still am wondering how you missed Norman Bardsley, as he was set up in the larger ballroom, or Howard Hitchmough, (who won Best Custom Knife award of show) as he was along the same row. I'm sure if you talked to Norm Bardsley or Jim Siska, (Both NCCA BOARD MEMBERS) they would tell you that its the rusty old pocket knives that inspire them in their work. It is the quality and craftsmanship of a Scagel that inspires custom makers, or say the workmanship of a pearl inlay Will & Fink dagger, having had some beautiful 150 year old pieces bought from me by custom makers, I know this as fact. Moreover, I know there must have been a Michael Walker knife for sale in that room as well

As show coordinator there were 97 tables, as I removed and rearranged as best I could for traffic flow. A word to the wise, refrain from using the term "rusty old pocket knives" when you are talking to some of our members who might have 20K KINGMAN & HASSAM bowie (circa 1850s) or say maybe a ROSE NY Bowie ( 20K -50K)in the case just under those pesky common old boy scout knives.
Good luck with your Knife Collecting and custom knife Career
Caroline Levine, volunteer coordinator for the NCCA Annual show
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Old 05-22-2006, 03:05 PM
Chris Meyer Chris Meyer is offline
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Mrs. Levine,

I was agreeing with striper28 when he said that the show was actually in "Waterbury", not Middletown. However, I mistakenly typed "Wallingford" instead of Waterbury. My error.

I was not trying to insult you or any of the other NCCA member when I stated that "... in my opinion, the NCCA's annual show has declined over the years, starting with the move to Stamford." I used to be a member of the NCCA, although I am not now, and I have nothing against the club. As I also said "I am not really even criticizing the people running the shows, although I do think the move to Stamford was a mistake." I think that the shows were better in East Windsor. I even speculated on the root cause of the problem, "Perhaps there are simply too many shows and the knifemaking/buying community is being spread too thin."

I did not miss Norman Bardsley but I could not get near his table because there were a couple of guys monopolizing the space in front of him. I looked at all the knives I could get near, and I did see some nice pieces and displays. As you may have noted in my first post, I mentioned that "There were some nice displays of Randalls, Queen folders, and some other old brands."

You said "A word to the wise, refrain from using the term 'rusty old pocket knives' when you are talking to some of our members..." While I am not a huge fan of old folding knives, I did not coin the phrase "rusty pocket knife shows". That came from from striper28, I just thought it was funny. Also, I generally refrain from saying things to people that I know would offend them.

The bottom line is that I gave my honest opinion of the latest 2006 NCCA show. I presented my review for the benefit of anyone else who was considering driving an hour or more to the show in the rain. I was disappointed with this year's show. If the show had been closer, perhaps I might have though differently. In any case, I made it clear that these were my opinions and everyone was free to agree or disagree.

Take care and have a nice day.


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Last edited by Chris Meyer; 05-22-2006 at 03:09 PM.
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