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The Newbies Arena Are you new to knife making? Here is all the help you will need.

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  #1  
Old 12-20-2014, 05:34 AM
tedster tedster is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: east coast
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Small knives by filing not grinding belts

My first post: Hello to all. I have been reading the forum off and on for a few years now.

I'm now retired and would like to try to make some rather small knives ie: penknives etc., nothing bigger than a Barlow probably. It's the small folding knives that interest me.

Could I please have a few members thoughts (tips even) on my coming undertaking? Recommendations on files would be so helpful.

Once again, greetings to all members, hope your upcoming Christmas will be nice.
I'm North American.

Cheers, Ted.
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  #2  
Old 12-20-2014, 08:36 AM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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Welcome Ted, and Merry Christmas!

I would suggest you make a couple of fixed blade knives before trying a folder. Doing so will give you experience with shaping the blades, doing the all important heat treating, and experience in finishing the steel as well as the handle materials. That's a lot to learn right there. When you have that mastered then you won't get side tracked while try to learn folder specific things like making and finishing parts precisely , heat treating for spring temper, fitting the parts so that there is no slop and so that the knife will 'walk and talk' .

It never hurts to have a few small fixed blades around for Christmas and birthday presents anyway ...


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Old 12-20-2014, 08:47 AM
tedster tedster is offline
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Hi Ray, thank you for those tips....I will indeed do a few small straight knives...(it actually was my intention to do so for the reasons you suggest but wanted to keep my first post succinct).

Do you have any tips on files Ray ie: possible brand names you prefer, types, sizes you prefer? Where do you get yours...etc.

There's a million threads of 'grinder intelligence' in the forum but much less 'file intelligence' that I can seem to find.

Thanks again for your help....it's appreciated.
Ted
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  #4  
Old 12-20-2014, 09:27 AM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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There is some 'file intelligence' here, at least the question has been posted in the past and should still be available to Search. Try searching 'mill bastard', that's a file that gets used a lot. Mainly, any high quality large file will be useful. I'm fond of my 'Magic Cut' file for cleaning up after the rougher files have removed material. Money spent on high quality files is never wasted as they will be useful even if you buy a good grinder later.

We have a chat room every Sunday evening, you should try to drop in. Details are in one of the Sticky threads at the top of the forum ...


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  #5  
Old 12-20-2014, 11:31 AM
MikeT MikeT is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2013
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Howdy Ted-

As someone who uses files almost exclusively, I have a few opinions on files. For hogging material, I prefer Swiss 00 files, then move to the American cut files to give a better finish before moving on to shop roll/ sand paper. Draw filing with a single cut smooth file can give a very nice finish that would surprise you.

File in one direction only, lift up on the return stroke. Filing back and forth will dull the teeth. Make a stand for your files, banging into each other dulls them too. You'll need a file card too to keep them clean. When finishing, you might want clean the file after every stroke- a piece of pinned material that scratches your work will make you want to cuss for sure.

Loveless's book has a great chapter on making a knife with files. Its how I started.
http://www.amazon.com/How-Make-Knives-Richard-Barney/dp/087341389X http://www.amazon.com/How-Make-Knives-Richard-Barney/dp/087341389X


I'll go through my files and make a list of ones I think would serve you well to start out. I'll have to disagree with Ray, I don't care for those magi cut files.

These knives were done with files, a little bit of grinding for the profiling and a scotch brite belt for the finish, but all the hard work was by hand.




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  #6  
Old 12-20-2014, 01:29 PM
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BCROB BCROB is offline
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Welcome to the addiction Ted !!
Some good points already had here.....keep it small , keep it very simple, get your heat treating down and progress from there...and Merry Christmas !!


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  #7  
Old 12-20-2014, 06:21 PM
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ericbrinkerhoff ericbrinkerhoff is offline
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Files rule!
But good ones are getting hard to find indeed.
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  #8  
Old 12-20-2014, 06:54 PM
tedster tedster is offline
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Thank you so much Mike. Your file info is most appreciated. I do look forward to your list.

While I look forward to using various woods for handles I also anticipate using micarta, horn and bone for handles. How do you deal with them in terms of correct files'/rasps; ...do you use the same files you used for your wood or do you use dedicated and/or different rasps/files?

I have been reading about how to take care of your files ie: hang them up, no banging them, keeping them clean etc.

I intend to use the softer steels but will send them out for heat treatment for my first year.
As I like small bladed knives (i'm not a hunter) I was hoping that the need for a belt grinder would be less serious as a result. I like the idea of taking my time and becoming skillful with files.

Of course I understand that there's no getting around the need for a high quality drill press. I have read how important their precision is inorder to build a quality folder.

Thanks again Mike and thank you Ray for the Sunday night meeting.
ted



Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeT View Post
Howdy Ted-

As someone who uses files almost exclusively, I have a few opinions on files. For hogging material, I prefer Swiss 00 files, then move to the American cut files to give a better finish before moving on to shop roll/ sand paper. Draw filing with a single cut smooth file can give a very nice finish that would surprise you.

File in one direction only, lift up on the return stroke. Filing back and forth will dull the teeth. Make a stand for your files, banging into each other dulls them too. You'll need a file card too to keep them clean. When finishing, you might want clean the file after every stroke- a piece of pinned material that scratches your work will make you want to cuss for sure.

Loveless's book has a great chapter on making a knife with files. Its how I started. http://www.amazon.com/How-Make-Knive.../dp/087341389X


I'll go through my files and make a list of ones I think would serve you well to start out. I'll have to disagree with Ray, I don't care for those magi cut files.

These knives were done with files, a little bit of grinding for the profiling and a scotch brite belt for the finish, but all the hard work was by hand.




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  #9  
Old 12-21-2014, 07:11 AM
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Crex Crex is offline
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Good cover by Mike & Ray (I do use magi-cuts sometimes as well).
Not that it will help you much, but I forge my blades to 90%+ finish such that I only need to do a little drawfiling to take out a few missed high spots and true the edge. I then hand sand to finish, same as Mike. It does take some practice, but you will develop a feel for the file to surface contact and everything will click into place between your mind and hands.
One thing that is crucial to good filing is securely immobilize the piece you are working on. Lot of friction going on during the process and you can't have any "squirming".
File card and pick are essentials to keeping you files in working condition. Get them and use them.


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