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The Newbies Arena Are you new to knife making? Here is all the help you will need.

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  #1  
Old 12-03-2015, 08:36 AM
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Hunter10139 Hunter10139 is offline
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Latest Knife....Hunter in spalted pecan

Hey guys, this is my latest knife. This one was commissioned by my stepdad for a fun auction for a beefmaster cattle organization he's in. I chose the pecan wood since it's the state tree of Texas.

New Jersey Steel Baron 1084

Heated to 815C and quenched in water prior to bevels being ground

Tempered 3 times a 425F.

~59 Rockwell C, I didn't measure the hardness on this one but I am very familiar with the bar of steel this blade came from and I've heat treated several knives that have come out with this hardness using the same process on.

600 grit "gator" (Trizact) belt finish on bevels and false edge. 400 grit hand finish on flats. I used this finish because I had to restart from scratch due to a stress crack in the blade on the first knife. My stepdad loved the finish and I didn't have time to show him a hand finish to see which he liked better

Handle material is stabilized spalted pecan with brass mosaic pins.

False edge is ground almost sharp.

Comments and critique's are appreciate
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Old 12-03-2015, 08:44 AM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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Very fine work! Why a water quench though? Not much of a plus side to using water and a pretty good chance of cracking the blade (now or later) as you discovered .....


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Old 12-03-2015, 09:09 AM
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Well honestly it's because I haven't had good luck quenching in oil. I tried quenching in canola oil without grinding the bevels and it wasn't successful. I'll probably try again, I just didn't have time to verify the process before I had to finish the knife.

Edit: Also, thanks for the compliment. I posted this reply and immediately realized I didn't say thanks. My bad.


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Old 12-03-2015, 10:48 AM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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You might need a faster oil. I use Tough Quench from Brownell's, and Parks 50 is also very popular. Either oil will quench almost as fast as water - fast enough to create a hamon when desired - but won't crack the steel like water tends to do a fair percentage of the time ...


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Old 12-03-2015, 04:33 PM
PoolQs PoolQs is offline
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Great looking knife !!
I'm sure the cattle org will love it.
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Old 12-03-2015, 07:33 PM
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Nice looking knife.
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Old 12-03-2015, 07:41 PM
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Very nice!
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Old 12-04-2015, 06:12 AM
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Are you warming your canola oil to 120 deg before quenching?
Sounds like you are quenching in cool room temp oil.

I use Aldo's 1084 to teach my students and quench in heated canola all the time with glass hard results.
However Ray is right about the other two oils, they will produce good results.....just mighty pricey.

Nice knife.


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Last edited by Crex; 12-04-2015 at 06:18 AM.
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Old 12-04-2015, 07:13 AM
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Thanks guys.

No, I warmed the oil in an oven before quenching. It may have just been that there wasn't a large enough volume. It was probably about a gallon of oil.

Could it just be an issue with too much heated mass for the oil to cool down in time? The steel is .186 inches thick. It would probably work when grinding bevels prior to heat treatment but I'm not confident it will if I don't grind them.


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Old 12-04-2015, 07:46 PM
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You need a lot more than a gallon of oil. Canola is cheap, quench in 5 gallons, bet that'll change your results!
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Old 12-04-2015, 08:21 PM
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Ah, so i it a volume problem. Thanks naboyle.


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Old 12-05-2015, 05:52 AM
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Depends on how you are quenching. If you are just quenching the blade section and not the whole chunk of steel, 1 gal. of canola at 120 deg. should have worked ok. Larger volume of quench is usually better, especially if you are doing multiple blades. However heating that much on the kitchen stove is not so user friendly.
How are you judging the temp of the oil?
Is your HT oven in the same room as your heated quench?
If just quenching the blade area, are you allowing enough time for the rest of the steel to cool down below 400 deg before removing from quench? There appears to be a lot of mass in the handle section of the blade which can hold a lot of residual heat.
Just curious on the temper - why 3 times and at 425? There's no appreciable gain past one temper cycle on 1084 and 425 is a bit hot for this steel. Most recommend between 375 to 400 to stay anywhere close to 59 Rc.


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Old 12-05-2015, 08:37 AM
Darren12 Darren12 is offline
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Very nice knife, I really like that wood!


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Old 12-05-2015, 04:46 PM
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Yeah I heated the oil in an industrial oven and then brought it to the furnace and quenched straight from the furnace. Actually, the test samples when I first compared oil and water were small rectangular sample.

Third temper was used to straighten out warp.

According to Kevin cashens heat treatment information 425 is about what you want for 59 RC. Well he says 58 at 450F and 60 at 400 so by interpolation you get 425 for 59. This matches up with the results I've received from the steel and I've tested the hardness with a 3000 kg load on a 10 mm ball on a brinell tester and I have conversion charts to go to Rockwell C. I consistently get RC of about 59 and I've tested several knives.


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Old 12-05-2015, 05:02 PM
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Also, I typically do 2 1 hour tempers Carl, sorry forgot to mention that. I've just always done the tempering that way, should I just switch to 1 2 hour temper?


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