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The S.R. "Steve" Johnson Forum Specialized knife making tips, technique and training for "ultra precision" design work enthusiasts.

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  #16  
Old 12-06-2002, 01:22 PM
jbgatlin jbgatlin is offline
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This is an interesting thread. It hasn't been very long ago that I had a conversation with a mastersmith about the same topic. He stated that if he made a knife for himself that it would be around 1/8 " but that most he made were 3/16 or more. He said customers prefer it. I think that if one only uses the knife as it was built for, then 1/8" to 3/16 is plenty. I know that I prefer the look of the thicker spines with distal taper.
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  #17  
Old 12-07-2002, 10:46 AM
Dan Graves Dan Graves is offline
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customer not always right.

The customer is not always right but, they get what they order. If a customer orders a skinner and ask for 1/4 inch thick steel, I try to lead them into a direction of 1/8 inch steel and I do this gently but eventually make a 1/4 thick knife. I find it funny, like a guy who hires a lawyer for advice and then does what he thinks is best. But you give them what they want.


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  #18  
Old 12-08-2002, 04:13 PM
Jason Cutter Jason Cutter is offline
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Lightbulb I make, I use

I used to collect and now I make every knife I need to use. I admit to my personal anxieties when purchasing a knife - I always used to look at those 1/4inch thick "battle blades" - the magical thickness for "strength". Of course, accompanied by the thick sabre gring - it couldn't cut finely, which made it useless for most daily tasks.

Accompanying thickness is of course weight. There is nothing more irritating than a sheath that is pulling on the belt. Undo your pants to have a pee and your jeans hit the ground like a ton of bricks - a strange way to look at the weight issue, but after this happens a few times, you'll chuck the big whacker for a lighter blade.

Based PURELY on the thinking expressed on this thread, I made 2 new knives this weekend. 2 I call "FEATHER" - 4inch small game / bird & trout hunters. These are both with 3/32inch thick blades with a little distal taper as well ! They are truly featherweight and feel almost nothing in the hand, despite the 4inch blades. The leather sheaths weigh more than the knives themselves !!

The task will then be to see if they sell. Just because I think they look nice and seem a great idea, I know from having been a "customer" myself - sometimes there's no convincing people.

Cheers.


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  #19  
Old 12-08-2002, 08:06 PM
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SVanderkolff SVanderkolff is offline
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Jason
Could we see these feather weights. I admit I prefer the lighter blades myself and in fact use strictly 1/8 stock for the knives I make. Mind you I am also doing flat grind with a distal taper. I thought part of the idea of tapering or hollowing the tang was to lose weight so why do all that and then use a heavier width. Or is the idea to give the look of heavy without the feel of heavy?
Steve V
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  #20  
Old 12-08-2002, 08:28 PM
Dan Graves Dan Graves is offline
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lighter

Jason, lets see em. I bet they are a dream in the field and are easier to sharpen. Another plus for thin blades.


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  #21  
Old 12-08-2002, 08:29 PM
Jason Cutter Jason Cutter is offline
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Lightbulb

Steve, I wonder if you misunderstand. I'm using 3/32inch stock which is less than 1/8inch thick. Though the blades are 4inch long, they are quite slender - like most other small game hunters patterns. Full height flat ground, the blades are also distal tapered from about 1/3up its length, so the end result is a very light blade which looks almost closer to a 1/16inch thickness. The hidden tang, which is also 4inches long, is heavily drilled. The handles, eg.- the one with linen Micarta mortised handles are under 1/2inch thick at their absolute widest. The handle, like the blade is tall and flat - this seems to get the best of weight vs. strength. Make no mistake, these knives are NOT for prying, not that any knives ever are. There is quite a bit of flex in those blades.

Haven't sorted out out posting pictures yet. But I think you're right - the knives do LOOK heavier than they feel. My biggest critic - my wife was quite surprised when she picked them up.

My point was that many customers push for a thicker blade than is necessary, IMHO. I am very favourably influenced by Ed Fowler's philosophy of a knife being able to do everything and thus needing to be extremely tough. At the same time, I find that most steels (esp. good old carbon steels) are supremely tough for their thickness and our tendency to go for thicker blades is borne out of anxiety about blade failure, than about reality. I must qualify that I am then intending thinner blades to NOT be used to chisel through bone and split rib cages, leg a deer etc.

I don't think there's a correct or wrong answer to this. The Nepalese have been using their kukri's for generations for just about every cutting task - most have thick heavy bevels with blades up to 3/8inch thick. I'm not about to tell them they're barking up the wrong tree.

Just some good food for thought. Cheers.


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  #22  
Old 12-08-2002, 08:34 PM
Jason Cutter Jason Cutter is offline
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OK, I need to figure out how to post pictures. Can anyone direct me ? There must be a how-to or something like that. You guys can tell that they don't call me the Technology Moron from Down Under for no reason. I only got email about 10 weeks ago !
I'm actually keen to share those pictures of the 2 "Feather weights" with you since I wouldn't have made them if it weren't for this thread.

Thanks in advance. Cheers.


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  #23  
Old 12-08-2002, 08:42 PM
Dan Graves Dan Graves is offline
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pics

Jason, you need a server or a domain to host your pictures. I hope I said that right as I am learning to. e-mail those pics to me and I will try to get them up now. Dan@theknifemaker.com
There is a tutorial in the How to section of this forum.


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Last edited by Dan Graves; 12-08-2002 at 09:08 PM.
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  #24  
Old 01-30-2003, 10:26 AM
T. Hendrickson T. Hendrickson is offline
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blade thickness

This is an interesting thread. i have learned a lot from it already. I would also like to see those "featherweights" made by Jason.
I personally use 1/8" for all my blades (mostly 3-5" blades) and occasionally use 3/16 on larger ones, though not often. I've never used 5/32 but I suppose it would also be good although by no means necessary - 1/8" works great for my hollow grinds
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  #25  
Old 01-30-2003, 01:47 PM
wrathlord wrathlord is offline
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Sorry to butt in,I actually don't have a "standard" stock for any model I make, can be made from1/16" to 7/32", I think that it's the choice of the task,user and pocket book,Thats what us custom guys are all about,isn't it??
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  #26  
Old 01-30-2003, 04:23 PM
Jason Cutter Jason Cutter is offline
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Thumbs up Yup, the whole custom thing.

Besides what we think as makers, most of us must be driven by what the customer is CONVINCED he/she NEEDS to have. I often recommend something but take into account there's no changing some people's minds. I suppose same applies to me.

Yup, there's some thing for everyone and IMHO, no single knife, does everything just as well. (Methinks entrepid knifemakers have been looking for that ultimate knife for a long, long time.)

My website will be up soon and the 2 Featherweights will be featured in the galleries. Take a look on www.jcbknives.com in the next 2 weeks. Only the home page is up at the moment - still in development. I'm interested to know what you guys think about those.

Ciao.


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  #27  
Old 03-04-2003, 06:40 PM
Jason Cutter Jason Cutter is offline
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Resurrecting an older thread.

Guys, my website is up and I'm just fulfilling a old promise to show the "Feather" knives with thin blades. These are featured on my website. Both have the same shape/size 3-3/4inch O-1 blades of 3/32inch thickness and also a distal taper and some chamfering taken off the spine. Full flat ground. 60-61HRC at the edge. The handles are respectively red deer and mortised and mated black-and-olive linen Micarta with invisible seams (mosaic pins, NS fittings etc.) Both were designed to be nearly weightless in the hand and certainly look a lot heavier than they actually are. The Red Deer handle one is actually almost 10" OAL, the Micarta handled one is closer to 9" OAL so are full-sized working knives.





Thanks for looking. Just thought I'd show you.

Cheers.


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  #28  
Old 03-04-2003, 11:43 PM
Gabe Newell Gabe Newell is offline
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Jason, have you had a chance to weigh them?

Gabe
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  #29  
Old 03-05-2003, 03:29 PM
Jason Cutter Jason Cutter is offline
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Yup.

I'll do that.

I made a "test" one for the guy locally who probably has the largest number of my knives. A fervent and professional hunter and venison processor, what more could you want, an ample supply of half-decent custom knives for field testing for just about free. I do some simple barters and swops with him. He carried this one on his belt for a couple of days on a hunt and the only problem he faced was not knowing if the knife and sheath was still there since he couldn't feel the usual weight on his belt.

The sheath weighs more than the knife, and unless I go for Kydex, I can't make the sheath any lighter.

However, I will weigh it to give an objective number to what I am talking about. PS.- these sorts of knives are not hard to make and many makers make them to the same level, but just making a point that very light knives with thin blades can be made and do a good job.

Cheers.


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  #30  
Old 06-13-2003, 04:35 PM
MSoerensen MSoerensen is offline
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i have found the thread Stephen Vanderkolff is referring to

the link


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