MEMBER ITEMS FOR SALE
Custom Knives | Other Knives | General Items
-------------------------------------------
New Posts | New PhotosAll Photos



Go Back   The Knife Network Forums : Knife Making Discussions > Custom Knife Discussion Boards > Knife Making Discussions > The Damascus Forum

The Damascus Forum The art and study of Damascus steel making.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-15-2015, 04:47 PM
ss caustic ss caustic is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Canada
Posts: 17
Question: Blade material - 12c27, 1095-

Good day all , I'll though I'm new to the blade forum world , I've been researching extensively for the past several weeks on the topic of forging blade.
forging is indeed new to me, but metal work..., I've been doing for 20yrs or so. and am looking for some guidance.

I have a vision for the look of a knife I'd like to attempt to make, and I'm in the process of narrowing down the materials I'd like to use. providing they will play well together, and this is where i require guidance at the moment.

the look of knife in the end will be stainless core of 12c27 laminated with a very fine line pattern welded "Damascus" thinking of using more 12c27 and 1095(and or 10xx lower) for this. again this is to obtain the look i want.

I'm just looking for clarification on if these steels will work together through out a differential ( hammon ) heat treat.

it seems by my research so far that they will but perhaps I missed something.

any and all welcome to reply , much appreciated!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-15-2015, 05:14 PM
jmccustomknives jmccustomknives is offline
Skilled
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Alabama
Posts: 554
I would stay away from the 12C27. I'm not saying it couldn't be done but you'll have to can weld it. The skill level necessary to do this is beyond most. Stainless steels typically doesn't take to a fine layer count. I would suggest using L-6/1080. Getting a hammon will be difficult to impossible with the high chromium steels.
I'm sure one of the master smith's here can drop in on it.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-15-2015, 05:43 PM
ss caustic ss caustic is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Canada
Posts: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmccustomknives View Post
I would stay away from the 12C27. I'm not saying it couldn't be done but you'll have to can weld it. The skill level necessary to do this is beyond most. Stainless steels typically doesn't take to a fine layer count. I would suggest using L-6/1080. Getting a hammon will be difficult to impossible with the high chromium steels.
I'm sure one of the master smith's here can drop in on it.
aaah , you're right , now I recall that I did read that high chromium is no go for hammon, I was just liking some of info I found on 12c27 for an edge

lots of info to remember and retain.

thanks for the suggestion on materials, I'll need to look in to the L-6.

to add:
the only reason I was thinking of 12c27 in the Damascus was to keep the color constant with the inner core.

side note:

is there a list of (etching colors / materials) somewhere that any of you have come across.

Last edited by ss caustic; 01-15-2015 at 05:51 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-15-2015, 05:49 PM
ss caustic ss caustic is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Canada
Posts: 17
anyone know the threshold of chromium in order for a hammon to appear.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-15-2015, 06:26 PM
jmccustomknives jmccustomknives is offline
Skilled
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Alabama
Posts: 554
Any chromium will start to effect the hammon. However one can be coaxed from 5160. L-6 which has about the same Chromium content, but the L-6 has nickle. I have never seen any hint of a hammon for L-6.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-15-2015, 07:15 PM
ss caustic ss caustic is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Canada
Posts: 17
at the end of the day this W2 chef's knife has the basic color I'd love to obtain but I'd like there to be thin wisps of the edge color running through the darker part of the blade in the form of a very fine "twisted Damascus" lines.

http://www.chefknivestogoforum.com/r...ore-t6298.html

thoughts

Last edited by ss caustic; 01-15-2015 at 07:40 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-15-2015, 07:42 PM
ss caustic ss caustic is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Canada
Posts: 17
at the end of the day this W2 chef's knife has the basic color I'd love to obtain but I'd like there to be thin wisps of the edge color running through the darker part of the blade in the form of a very fine "twisted Damascus" lines.

ht tp://www.chefknivestogoforum.com/rader-257mm-w2-slicer-nfs-anymore-t6298.html

my understanding is 15n20 should work, are there any other options?

thoughts

Last edited by ss caustic; 01-15-2015 at 07:51 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-16-2015, 01:05 PM
ss caustic ss caustic is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Canada
Posts: 17
I think I'm going to settle on a W2 core with a w2 and 15N20 Damascus San-mai construction

thanks again for your input!
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-17-2015, 12:18 PM
Gary Mulkey's Avatar
Gary Mulkey Gary Mulkey is offline
Guru
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Branson, Mo
Posts: 1,129
I have used a lot of the "W" series steels as well as the 15N20 and both are excellent steels for bladesmithing. In fact, W2 (or W1) is my primary choice for a mono-steel blade and 15N20 goes into every damascus blade that I make. When using W2 you need to know how to manage the carbides and grain size which makes the normalizing & H/T'ing a little more complex than your 10xx steels. If you haven't used it enough to become very familiar with it then I would recommend testing a few blades of it to destruction until you are confident in your H/T'ing.

Most who make Damascus blades use 1084 with the 15N20 as they are the most compatible steels for layering a blade and will provide excellent contrast when etched. I have used this combination in cutting competitions and know that they will make a quality performing blade. I think that you would find that most ABS master smiths have used these same two steels for their performance testing blades which says something about their cutting qualities.

All my best,
Gary


__________________
Gary
ABS,CKCA, ABKA,KGA
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:18 PM
ss caustic ss caustic is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Canada
Posts: 17
Ya I've been reading a ton the past day or so on HT, normalizing , spheroidal anneal etc.. , man that is some interesting stuff.

I do intent on testing procedure and samples as I get closer to attempting the actual knife.

thanks!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
1095, 5160, abs, art, bee, blade, damascus, damascus blade, edge, etching, forging, forging blade, heat, heat treat, how to, knife, make, material, materials, metal, pattern, stainless, steel, weld


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Another 1095 question ckwatson Heat Treating and Metallurgy 11 04-16-2012 02:13 PM
new guy with a 1095 question trclements Heat Treating and Metallurgy 7 09-16-2009 04:19 PM
1095 blade and ss handle? brittgudowski Knife Making Discussions 2 05-10-2009 05:41 PM
Question about 1095 ErnieB Ed Caffrey's Workshop 5 12-11-2005 02:19 PM
1095 question K Juedes Knife Making Discussions 6 08-18-2004 02:45 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:33 AM.




KNIFENETWORK.COM
Copyright © 2000
? CKK Industries, Inc. ? All Rights Reserved
Powered by ...

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
The Knife Network : All Rights Reserved