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The Newbies Arena Are you new to knife making? Here is all the help you will need.

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  #1  
Old 01-05-2014, 02:11 PM
RHammer RHammer is offline
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First HT

My first HT attempt with 1084. I ran it up to 1475 and let it soak 5 minutes. I had 2 pieces of rebar in the oven and dropped them into 3 gal of peanut oil then quenched the blade. After that I normalized at 400 degrees for 1 hour x 2. When I got done I hit the handle with a file and got this. Not sure if it is just the scale scratching or the steel. I still need to clean it up to find out for sure. Thoughts??
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File Type: jpg HT.jpg (11.2 KB, 111 views)

Last edited by RHammer; 01-05-2014 at 02:41 PM.
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  #2  
Old 01-05-2014, 02:29 PM
jmccustomknives jmccustomknives is offline
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You generally don't want your handle to be hard, nor is it the part you'd want to test. Test the edge. See if that file cuts into the edge or skates over it. Also you tend to want to do that test after quenching but before tempering as after tempering it will be softer than the file.\
About the only test you can do, if you are brave, is a drop test. Hold it out in front and drop it tip first on a concrete floor. If it breaks it's to hard, if the tip rolls it's to soft and if it leaves a nice divot you got it right.
If you do that test, wear safety gear and don't drop it on your foot.
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  #3  
Old 01-05-2014, 02:40 PM
metal99 metal99 is offline
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Did you mean 1475 or 475? If you quenched at 475 it didn't harden at all.


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Old 01-05-2014, 02:40 PM
RHammer RHammer is offline
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Good point. I forgot the skate test had to be full hard. I did your drop test. It poked a small hole in the cement. Absolutely no breakage or rolling. Looks like I might be on to something!

I sure appreciate everything I learn from this forum!! Thanks
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  #5  
Old 01-05-2014, 02:40 PM
RHammer RHammer is offline
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I meant 1475.
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  #6  
Old 01-05-2014, 02:45 PM
metal99 metal99 is offline
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Ok lol I was hoping you mistyped that. If you didnt take your time getting into the quench bucket and you were slightly above non magnetic you should be good. Like mentioned above check the edge with the file next time. I've found that some full tang knives I've heat treated didn't harden in the handle area which isn't a bad thing.


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  #7  
Old 01-05-2014, 02:55 PM
metal99 metal99 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RHammer View Post
Good point. I forgot the skate test had to be full hard. I did your drop test. It poked a small hole in the cement. Absolutely no breakage or rolling. Looks like I might be on to something!

I sure appreciate everything I learn from this forum!! Thanks
Missed your post before I replied. Sounds like you did something right! That's a hard test to get the courage to do lol.


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  #8  
Old 01-05-2014, 02:59 PM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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How do you know you had 1475? Electric oven? Hard to be that precise with a forge, especially for soak time. Anyway, you have the formula about right and so far your results sound good. The rest of the test would be to sharpen that blade and then test the edge for flex and chipping (a brass rod is good for this). Finally - and this is the fun part - clamp the first two inches of the blade tip between two pieces of hardwood in a vise, put a long pipe on the handle, and slowly bend it until it breaks (wear eye and face protection!). Examine the grain, should be very fine texture and an even light grey color. I'm sure you don't want to do this last step but this is your first HT on 1084 and this is part of the process of learning whether or not you got it right.

When you roll the sharpened edge you may find signs of some chipping (use magnification). A 400 degree temper might be a tad hard for 1084 so check carefully and raise the temp 25 degrees if you see any chipping ...


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Old 01-05-2014, 03:07 PM
RHammer RHammer is offline
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Thanks Ray. I am using an electric oven. As long as the thermometer is right, the temp should be right on. I was making this knife for the hardening KITH but I thought I should get some idea if it was even close before asking you guys to take the time to test it.

Can you give me a little more detail on the brass rod edge test? Diameter of rod? Are you trying to cut the rod or roll the rod with the edge of the knife?

Thanks again.
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Old 01-05-2014, 03:25 PM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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Just roll the edge on the rod, any rod size will do but 1/4" is what I use. If its for the HT KITH then you can just send it to me and I'll break it and do the Rockwell testing...


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  #11  
Old 01-05-2014, 03:36 PM
RHammer RHammer is offline
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I think I will make another one for the KITH. I want to roll this and break it just to see what happens. The way I figure it, this is kind of like reloading ammunition. I have to test each component before I get the accuracy I want. If I don't take time to learn the qualities of each material I use then I won't get the best performance.

That said, I really appreciate you taking time to run the KITH and I look forward to getting your feedback!
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Old 01-05-2014, 04:10 PM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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That's exactly the right attitude! Drop into the Chat Room tonight if you have the chance ...


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  #13  
Old 01-05-2014, 04:18 PM
RHammer RHammer is offline
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I will try. Been there a couple of times. Always good info.

Rod
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  #14  
Old 01-06-2014, 07:13 AM
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Crex Crex is offline
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Here's the real issue that has not been addressed......rebar. Rebar is a very inconsistent steel source for blade material. Yes, can be used, but serious testing will show that the carbon content varies inch to inch along it's length. So, you can have hard and soft spots all along a blade. Rebar is made from melted down scrap steel and only has to meet "batch" testing standards that are very broad in their requirements. Not like standard blade steels.
Yes, it's plentiful and cheaply available, easy to forge, etc., but what do you really have when you finish all your work? Sure, play with it and have fun but don't sell or give it away as a knife. It will ruin any reputation you have or intend to build as a credible knifemaker.
That being said, rebar does make great throwing darts/knives (where carbon content is not all that important).


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  #15  
Old 01-06-2014, 11:55 AM
metal99 metal99 is offline
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Crex, I believe he was using the rebar to pre heat his oil lol


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1084, bee, blade, brass, cold, edge, file, forge, full tang, handle, harden, heat, knife, knives, make, material, post, quenched, rebar, rod, scale, steel, tang, temper, vise


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