"NEW STEEL properties question.

[SPryor]

Just wondering what ya'll might think about this new steel, based on the properties. It's supposed to be comparable to D2 but wayyy better.

Higher hardness (62-64 HRc) than D2 after heat treatment.
Twice the toughness of D2 with superior wear resistance.
Substantially higher fatigue strength compared to D2.
Smaller primary carbides than D2 protect the
die from chipping and cracking.
Secondary refining process (DLF) reduces impurities.
Machines and grinds up to 40% faster than D2.
Less residual stress after wire EDMing.

[Shakudo]

new? are you sure? what is the name of this new steel?

[fitzo]

I'll play

TLS Vertex? It's close if not exact!

[SPryor]

Right now the name is unimportant. Just wanting opinions on what others think of it, as far as knife applications go, based on it's properties. If it's "all that" I may see about supplying it.

[Shakudo]

the common and known name is important if you want a real answer about how well this metal actually works in the real world.

[polarbearforge]

Looks like DC53 to me. http://www.imsteel.com/dc53.htm

I've never heard of it being used but it would be interesting to test.

Jamie

[Messinger]

Originally Posted by Shakudo

the common and known name is important if you want a real answer about how well this metal actually works in the real world.

Knowing the name also allows our personal biases to become an issue. We are mortal and can't help but form opinions based on things we hear, whether they are true or not. Over time we form "brand loyalty". If we stripped away all the names and reevaluated all the steels based only on composition without knowing names we might very well find that our favorites aren't what we thought they were. Just a thought.

-Ben

[Ray Rogers]

What Shakudo and jamie said is exactly right. Without knowing the name anything we say is only guessing. And, it does sound like DC53, especially since your description is almost verbatim from the link Jamie posted. But, that same link also says:

DC53 is a general-purpose
cold work die and mold
steel whose strength
and toughness approach
those of high-speed steels.


"Approach" those of high speed steels? That doesn't give me a warm and fuzzy where using it in a knife blade is concerned. All those specs sound good on paper but then so did LiquidMetal which turned out to bite rather big time as a blade material.

D2 is very tough if it's heat treated exactly right for a blade and it's not very good for an all purpose knife if that heat treat isn't right. D2 will also reach Rc 64 or better when heat treated but is useless as a blade at that hardness. Bottom line is, until somebody makes some knives from it and tests them very hard all the opinions in the world aren't going to justify investing in much of it for resale....

[SPryor]

Yes, it indeed is DC53. I just was hoping that some could give me an idea based on composition knowledge, rather than relying so heavily on a name. For those that lacked the knowledge to comment based on that alone, and placed the utmost importance on name alone..what say ye now?lol

[Shakudo]

the only i can say is most companies that make tooling have been marking their own trademarked names to metal already in use by other companies to cut back on competition. you may have the chemical percentages, but the standard uses and known qualities can be hidden. for example only .........admiral AD53 = DC53. that was a made up example that is common throughout the industry.

[SPryor]

Originally Posted by Shakudo

the only i can say is most companies that make tooling have been marking their own trademarked names to metal already in use by other companies to cut back on competition. you may have the chemical percentages, but the standard uses and known qualities can be hidden. for example only .........admiral AD53 = DC53. that was a made up example that is common throughout the industry.

So, does this mean your still clueless even after having the all important name.lol

[Shakudo]

the tool designer engineer sitting next to me says that you are probably clueless about the tooling industry.

[Andrew Garrett]

In way over my head here, but I do have a question.

If it has far superior wear resistance, how can it grind 40% faster? Isn't grinding just a very rapid form of wear?

[SPryor]

So even he has no knowledgable input?lol Granted, even after several yrs. as a machinist, I don't know a great deal about tool steels. But I do know that the DC53 is one, and would think a "tool designer" would have something more worthwhile to add. I mean, afterall, you both have "the name".:confused: :cool:

[Shakudo]

considering it is fairly new alloy and not just a renaming of a commonally used alloy. there appears to be little real info on it's uses besides the hype from the manufacturer. it is stated to be better than D2 for some applications.but the main uses are not what a knifemaker would want for a blade, sounds good for the forging dies on one of Bowie's hydraulic forges.

http://www.bssteel.co.th/english/dc53.htm

http://www.carrs-tool.co.uk/products/DC53Spec.htm