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High-Performance Blades Sharing ideas for getting the most out of our steel.

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  #16  
Old 01-11-2002, 11:40 AM
JerryO13
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Re: 420hc


Maybe we can get Darrel to chime in on this. Camillus uses 420hc for the EDC folder that Darrel designed for them.
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  #17  
Old 01-11-2002, 11:48 AM
Tom Mayo
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Re: 420hc


I dont know if this was mentioned above, but the whole point of making a handmade knife is about performance. Why start with something that is less than the best when you are going to spend so much labor making the thing??
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  #18  
Old 01-11-2002, 12:27 PM
JHossom
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Re: 420hc


I'm not arguing that 420HC would be my first choice for most knives, though it could be ideal for a couple of the uses mentioned above.

Ironically, I've heard dozens of people say they have trouble sharpening their Buck Hunters. Can you imagine what they would do with S30V?

PLUS, since we ruled out Talonite for a fishing knife because Mayo thinks it won't work (actually he just doesn't know how ), 420HC is a good bet.
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  #19  
Old 01-11-2002, 03:20 PM
Sam Wereb
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Re: 420hc


Tom's question is valid and really should be answered here. "Why start with something less than the best...."

There is too much alloy dogma in the other site, and I know you don't want that here. I just want to say that I think the answer is suitability. The best material for a professional-grade fillet knife might be Talonite(R). Nevermind the cost, you want the highest performance. In the same vein, the best tomahawk might just be made from S-7, yet no one ever thinks about it. That is a shame.

We don't know the answers because all the combinations haven't been tried. I think it's high time that they were. Never before has there been so many talented makers, nor have they ever able to communicate this easily. You wanted to build a forum to "Share ideas to get the most of (y)our steel." I contend that you should keep trying new things to have something to share, and to get the most out of the alloys.

The Crucible steels may end up being the best, in every instance, but I think that should be proven, not taken on faith.

Thanks, alot for allowing me to state my thoughts in this forum. I appreciate it.
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  #20  
Old 01-11-2002, 06:00 PM
Tom Mayo
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Re: 420hc


You are CERTAINLY right about that..........We are in the GOLDEN AGE OF KNIFEMAKING!!!!!!!
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  #21  
Old 01-11-2002, 07:11 PM
JHossom
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Re: 420hc


The simple fact is we don't know that 420HC isn't the best for some applications, because it's not been used to it's fullest capabilities. I have to confess this topic has intrigued me enough to want to try some of the stuff to find out what it might be capable of.
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  #22  
Old 01-11-2002, 09:09 PM
Sam Wereb
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Re: 420hc


Now you're talking.

If a steel producer were to adopt this and use really precise, clean processes it could be an excellent alloy. It's going to need a new name, though, to escape the stigma already shown.

How about Hossomite, or Jerrywear?(hehe!)
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  #23  
Old 01-12-2002, 07:30 AM
C L Wilkins
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Re: 420hc


That brings up a very curious question and it looks like this is the proper forum for the query.

I suppose the burning question would be:

In what specific application would 420HC out shine EVERY other blade material?

Personally, I can't think of a one but that doesn't mean anything. I am not making knives because NASA wasn't hiring!

Craig

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  #24  
Old 01-12-2002, 10:11 AM
JHossom
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Re: 420hc


It should make a great salt water use knife for heavy work. I'd think it should work great in a diving knife and would make a terrific filet knife. With a mirror finish it would be very corrosion resistant. At Rc58/59, it might make a great machete for tropical use; I'd have to test that first though. I've made them out of 154CM at Rc58/59 with pretty good results, and 420HC is more corrosion resistant than 154CM. (at least I think it is.)

On the filet knife thing, I used to go Cod fishing off New England every year (can't be geographically more specific than that because we were 4-5 hours out and I was lost). It was normal for most folks (20-30) on board to catch 200-300# of fish each. The mate had one cheap factory knife and the rest of us usually shared another, neither of which was sharpened much if at all. On the way back in we would filet all those fish (2-3 tons). Those knives did that most everyday of the week, all summer. My reason for mentioning this is that a filet knife (at least one used on Cod) did not experience a very demanding task. In fact if it were too sharp, it would cut the skin as you were trying to strip it off the filet.

Similarly, a diving knife is not a very demanding tool. It's most often a prybar, and sometimes used to cut through line or netting if you're entangled. I always thought they should have a serviceable point but many don't. Mostly, they just have to be corrosion resistant. Why wouldn't 420HC work as well as anything?

With a machete, which I've used a whole lot while with Uncle Sam in Panama, all you need is a reasonably serviceable and durable edge that is not too difficult to sharpen if you need to. High performance steels would be a pain to sharpen, and not buy you much in what you're cutting, like wood, brush and vines. Corrosion resistant would be an asset. With a wide convex edge, I've been able to get a 1095 Ontario machete at Rc50 to cut great and hold up for a very long time. I'd think 420HC would do at least as well and not rust in the process. And I might be inclined to draw it back to maybe Rc54/55 to make sharpening even easier.

This might be something like why a Ford F150 is better than a Ferrari.
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  #25  
Old 01-14-2002, 02:28 PM
JerryO13
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Re: 420hc


Not to throw a wrench into the works, but does anyone know anything about X15 that/'s the steel ythat Boker is using on some new knives and they are calling them rust free (not stainless) they've been tested and they do not rust. those would make excellent dive knives. Most dive knives don't have points cause they are used to pry. On many the front flat is chisel ground for prying, opening muscles, etc.
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  #26  
Old 10-10-2011, 12:10 AM
dirtydancer dirtydancer is offline
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hard use knife

hey guys. in my opinion, there's a lot more to a knife than the worlds best edge holder. I have used a lot of blades by a lot of companies and have been dissapointed by many "high end" knives, and surprised by some of the lower end ones. part of this reason is as it turns out, some of the pleasant surprises are 420 HC... it's a very tough blade, almost impervious to rust and it holds an edge pretty well in the field ...more importantly the ability to resharpen it. knives that hold their edge forever are very novel, but when they dull, they are impossible to sharpen in less than perfect circumstances. and being a soldier, a knife you can use as a pry bar is more common than you would care to imagine.
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  #27  
Old 01-12-2012, 02:31 PM
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OldMan OldMan is offline
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Anyone have a source for 420HC steel in 3/16" widths up to 2 1/2"??

I'd like to try it on a set of throwers. Cost is important.

regards,
Dave Suitor
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  #28  
Old 01-14-2012, 05:14 PM
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Gary Mulkey Gary Mulkey is offline
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Bruce,

A big part of making a custom knife is to achieve quality performance (at least IMHO). You need to decide if the quantity of the 420HC that you have is worth the time in production & testing to make it worth your while to use as a blade steel. If so, make a number of knives from it and do the testing. If it performs in a way that you are proud to put your name on the knives then definately use it. If not, then you've still got a good supply of material for handle fittings.

There is no perfect steel for a knife blade. What works for you may not for me & visa-versa. I got a quantity of it a few years back but since I'm not a fan of hypo-eutectoid steels, I have only used it for handle fittings. This doesn't mean that it won't work for you.
Do the testing and make your own decision.

Let us know how it works for you.

Gary


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  #29  
Old 09-26-2013, 03:00 PM
samiur samiur is offline
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420 is not so good if you want the perfect blade
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  #30  
Old 09-26-2013, 04:23 PM
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R. Yates R. Yates is offline
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Here is the best info I have for you.

420HC is a medium carbon stainless steel used extensively by Buck knives, and more specifically in the popular Buck 110. Paul Bos of Buck Knives does the heat treatment of 420HC and is considered to be one of the best, allowing the steel to take an extremely fine edge, rivaling even some of the premium steels in edge sharpness.

However, that sharp edge will not last as long with 420HC as with many other steels. It is only hardenable to RC55 and has fairly low wear resistance, so will require sharpening quite regularly. Compared with 440C, 420HC is much tougher and more corrosion resistant, even with its lower chromium content.

Not with that being posted if you have it in hand you wanted to know if it was feasible to make "good Quality knives from NO can knives be made from it YES can it be done in the back yard Not easily done .

if you have it try to make a few knives from it and test them by destroying a few of them and see how they do if you like the way them preform then by all means put your name on them and sell them if not use the steel for parts on a knife .

Best of luck

Sam


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