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  #1  
Old 07-02-2005, 02:56 AM
Dan Kenyon Dan Kenyon is offline
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Smile Aluminum guards and pommels

I want to use aluminum for a guard and pommel on a small bird and trout knife, I know that there is an aircraft grade aluminum that does not tarnish, read it somewhere but can't remember where . does anyone have any ideas?

Thank you
Dan

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  #2  
Old 07-02-2005, 11:30 AM
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I don't have a direct answer for you, but aluminum can be annodized for color, which helps prevent tarnish, so maybe you could do that if you can't find out about the kind you want.


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  #3  
Old 07-02-2005, 04:26 PM
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all aluminum will corrode. one of the strongest alloys that is used for aircraft is 6061. the good thing about Al. is it automatically grows a thin oxide layer when the metal is exposed. it almost heals itself. but if it isnt taken care of it can corrode bad.

as andrew said, you can anodize it to help prevent corrosion. the two main types are type 3 (hardcoat) which forms a thick oxide layer but can only be pigmented limited colors(dark grey, greyish green, black, etc) or a type 2 which is a much thinner coating that can be died many different colors or left its natural color, its often referred to as decorative anodizing. both will protect against corrosion but the hardcoat protects better due to being a thicker layer. as long as the layer isnt scratched off to expose the bare metal you wont have corrosion.

only certain alloys of Al will anodize well, 6061 anodizes well and is a fairly strong alloy. if you are thinking about anodizing keep in mind that unlike a titanium anodize which forms a clear layer(you dont add pigments, the colors you see is how the light is reflected off the anodize thickness) with Al. you have to add pigments which is nice because you can control the color of the finished product and do colors not available on titanium(ie red) but the pigments will fade with exposure to light.

ok ive rambled on long enough, if you have any questions feel free to ask. i work Al for jewelry and knives on occasion and have done anodizing so have some limited experience.
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Old 07-02-2005, 04:43 PM
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Aluminum is a superb material to use in knifemaking. Light weight, inexpensive and naturally corrosion "resistant", with minimum care. It has lost respect and has been taken for granted because it is so common. At one time it was considered a semi-precious metal. Someone on the forums here was doing experiments with alloying it with brass and or copper to make a yellowish color and to add toughness.


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  #5  
Old 07-02-2005, 06:12 PM
Dan Kenyon Dan Kenyon is offline
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Aluminum gaurds etc

Thank you for the info, the reason I am using auminum is because it is lighter than nickle silver and should look good on these knives. Next question where can I have the guards and pommels anodized - type 2- ? or is this something I could do myself? I saw plans for a ttanium anodizer, could something similar be used for aluminum ?
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  #6  
Old 07-02-2005, 10:00 PM
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Found this. It may be useful to see what is involved. Sounds like a wee pain for just a few pieces. I have several knives with aluminum hardwear and have never felt the need to polish them, but a quick wipe with 00 steel wool would seem to bring back the shine. The black anodize sounds like it would be cool for tactical or combat applications.
anodizing aluminum


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  #7  
Old 07-02-2005, 10:14 PM
Dan Kenyon Dan Kenyon is offline
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Aluminum guards etc

Thanks again for the info, the article on anodizing is cool, I might play around with anodizing, sounds fun even if not practicle, the posssibilities could be infinite.
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Old 07-02-2005, 10:26 PM
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to do a type 2 anodize is fairly easy, type 3 gets more in depth with temperature control. basically what you are doing is hooking up electrical current to your part, dipping it in electrolyte, then dying it if you choose, then sealing the pores. here is a basic rundown of how it can be done in a home workshop.

the electrical current can be provided by a simple car battery for small parts, or you can buy a car battery charger(must be manual, no automatic ones..they will shut off before the process is complete) i use a battery charger i bought from kmart for $75. the electrolyte used is sulfuric acid. you can use the sulfuric acid sold in automotive stores used to fill up batteries. dilute this 50% (always add acid to water, not water to acid)pour some in, mix slowly, pour more, making sure it doesnt heat up too much. if you add water to acid it can heat the water up to an instant boil and spray it all over your face. now you need a cathode (your Al parts will be the anode) you can use lead sheets or 6061 Al plates. i use lead sheet (1/16" thick)cut about 2"x4". there is a formula for figuring out the exact cathode to anode ratio but i dont recall it. my one size cathode works well for all the small parts ive done. you need a bucket to keep your acid in that wont be attacked by the acid, plastic buckets work well. the acid bath must be used at about 75degrees. very good ventilation is a MUST. i use an exhaust hood hooked to an old furnace blower motor. dont attempt to try this without something to suck the fumes away from you, not even outside.

for dye you can use many different dyes from food coloring to Rit fabric dye. dye made specifically for anodizing has some UV additives that help keep the colors from fading. to dye the part you pour your dye in a container and heat it up to about 140degrees, i use a ceramic coated metal pot i bought from walmart and a $10 hot plate burner i also got from walmart. soak the part for a bit, the longer the soak the more saturated the part will be with dye. 15min soak time is average.

to seal the part you can either use a nickel acetate mixed with water and heated to a boil, or just plain boiling water and suspend the parts above the water in the steam, place a lid overtop to keep a good steam going inside. steam the parts for a good 15-60mins(time depends on the thickness of the anodize and the temp of the steam). take them out and let them dry. if the parts feel tacky they didnt fully seal, place them back into the steam. to test if a part is fully sealed you can dip it in bleach...an unsealed part will have the color bleached away, a sealed part shouldnt be affected.

there are variables in the process but this is basically all there is to it, once you work out the initial gremlins its very easy. they sell kits with dyes, cathode, sealants, etc. i bought my first kit from www.caswellplating.com the downside to the process is there are some strict government guidelines dealing with anodizing(i think titanium anodizing falls under the same guidelines) and without the inspections/permits it is illegal to do. this isnt enforced much and there are many hobbyists doing it at home but there is always the potential that you could get in trouble. the main issue is the waste water damaging the enviroment and they want you to have good waste water management and not to be dumping it down the drain or in the backyard. i give my waste to a local plating company and they dispose of it for me. there are companies that will anodize for you, most have several hundred dollar minimums. if you would like to outsource maybe try paintball gun anodizers that are used to dealing with small quantities.

i left out info such as rinsing the parts, what is happening in the different stages, etc so this message didnt end up longer than it already is but thats the basics of it right there. you can get setup for about $200 and it takes 2hours to do a batch. any questions feel free to ask. i think caswell also has a forum and you can check out www.finishing.com website. finishing.com has some real experts there and they also list the guidelines.
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  #9  
Old 07-02-2005, 10:36 PM
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hammerdown linked you to a better explanation of the process as i was typing that out so my info is a bit redundant :P
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  #10  
Old 07-03-2005, 04:17 AM
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Aube, I hate it when that happens!
I got more out of what you said than at that link. More home grown info. Thanks for taking the time to write that.


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  #11  
Old 07-03-2005, 05:13 AM
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the more info the better, thanks for looking up the link for us!
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  #12  
Old 07-03-2005, 05:25 AM
Dan Kenyon Dan Kenyon is offline
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Aluminum guards etc.

All the info on anodizing is great , thanks, it may take a week or three but I plan on doing some experimenting, I have all sorts of cool visions in my head, will let you know how it turns out
Thanx again
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Old 07-03-2005, 11:55 AM
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I haven't considered using aluminum, but there's no reason it wouldn't work fine. Heck, Mr. Scagel used some in some of his stacked handles I've heard.


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  #14  
Old 07-03-2005, 01:36 PM
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Here is a pic of an aluminum frame and pommel I am making. It would be cool if I could get it annodized black to match the heat colored guard.
Bowie and frame handle.


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  #15  
Old 07-06-2005, 09:51 PM
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what do you use to minimize the corrosion of the alluminum?

thanks bill


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