High performance?

Ed, how do you rate performance? I am curently getting about 2 1/4 better performance from my forged 52100 blades as oposed to an ATS-34 blade that I use as a check blade.

The ATS-34 blade has been profesionaly heat treated, including cryo to 59-60 Rc.

The only other blades I have to compare are eigther my own or factory blades. The Ats-34 blade out performs all of the factory blades I have, and has about 15-20 percent better edge holding than the few 1095 blades I have made, although the 1095 was much easyer to sharpen. I am wondering how this comparison holds up.

I forge 52100 in the 15-1600 deg. F. range, then tripple noralize, tripple aneal in warm wood ashes, then tripple quench 24 hours apart. They then receave three two hour tempers at 375. I check the edge with a brass rod. If the edge chips, I temper once more at 25deg. hoter, again checking the edge.

I am using 1/2" sisal rope as a cutting meduim, and use a flat ground blade with a convex edge on both. I am wondering how this performance rates, and if there is any way to further increase edge holding.

Thanks

William

Hi William!
I personally judge "high performance" based on a number of things. Of course cutting ability, edge retention, and toughness are the main goals, however, on top of this I add a few other aspects that are customer oriented. Those are ease of re-sharpening, and also the ease with wich a blade cuts (the force that must be exerted in order to cut a given material)
I am of the opinion that there is always a give and take with knifemaking. IE: To obtain ease of re-sharpening, the hardness level, for the steel, with the chosen grind, must all be in correct balance. What is that balance? That is something that each maker must determine for their blades. I personally have little interest in rust resistance, and therefore my customers sacrifice corrosion resistance, in order to gain the cutting ability, toughness, and ease of resharpening that 52100 can offer.
To address your post specifically, it sounds as if your doing just about the same methodology that I am. The only difference is that my blades all come out with an Rc or 57-59. In fact the results are so predictable, that I haven't Rc tested a blade in over three years!
Are there ways to improve performance? ALWAYS! Never stop seeking improvement! When I started using cryo treatments, the cutting ability of my 52100 increased 15-20%. The average user would never be able to tell the difference between that and an non-cryo blade, but it sure excited me!
As far a what to use for comparison......I've always tried to use a blade that has the very best of the qualities I want in a blade, to date I've never seen better than what Ed Fowler puts out. I've been lucky enough to test a great number of "the big name" makers work, and have found none that will out perform what Fowler does. A few (including my own) blades are close, but when it comes to overall performance, his blades are still a step ahead. I consider that a good thing...........it gives me something to strive for, work at, and is a driving force for ME. The only reason that is true, is because Mr. Fowler and I share a lot of the same ideas where "high performance" is concerned.
There also comes a point when you ask yourself "How far do you take it?" I won't mention the number of cuts that I have achieved on 1/2 rope, becasue you, and likely anyone else who reads this post would call me a liar, but you can achieve some lofty numbers!
The search for increased performance will go on as long as knives are around, as long as you never loose the desire to improve, experiment, and seek better performance, there will always be advances wait to be discovered.

Ed,
Do you feel that 5160 would benefit from cryo as well?

Craig

Yes, it does. The small amounts of Cr. that are present in both steels are the key that makes not only the multiple heat treats so effective, but also is the cataylist for the cryo.

Thanks Ed, I havn't had the opertunity to test many good knives, in fact one of the reasons I got into knife making was because of the crap that knife companies are putting out, including some of the better american ones.

I have been playing with 52100 for a while, and out of every steel that I have tried, it has, to me,the best balance between edge holding and re-sharpening, and toughness. I also find it somewhat more stain resistant than the 10xx steels, although not by much. What I am wondering, is just on edge holding and cutting ability, every thing else being the same, is how good is twice the cuts of ATS-34? Should I be expecting 4 times or more? Or does this fall within the norm? How far can it be pushed? I would love to have one of your or Fowlers blades to make comparisons, but with money as tight as it is, that's not posible right now. I am very well satisfied so far, as compared to any knife I have tested, but am always seeking improvements.

I should also add that I don't have access to a power hammer, so every thing is done by hand. I have noticed a slight improvement by forging closer to shape, and working the metal more.

I know what you mean about the number of rope cuts, at first I didn't believe my own counts. I am averageing about 120 cuts on 1/2" sisal with my ats 34 check blade, wich is about double of the best factory knife I have. My 52100 blades are curently averageing 280-285 cuts. I don't know if I am cutting more rope or less than some other smiths, but I use the check blade as a referance, to give me some perspective.

BTW, I don't know the Rc of my 52100 blades, but would hazard a guess at around 58.

Thanks,

William