To buy HT oven or not?

[alexkuzn]

My next buy will be a disc grinder but I begin to lust about getting a nice HT oven eventually.
Do you think it's worth buying a HT oven and do HT yourself? Someone mention that professional HT service will do better job anyway, so why even bother?

Thanks,
Alex

[fitzo]

Originally Posted by alexkuzn

..... Someone mention that professional HT service will do better job anyway, so why even bother?
Thanks,
Alex

The concept of "sole authorship" appeals to many. While few do the entire process including making steel themselves, nonetheless this puts another essential process into the hands of the knifemaker. There is a certain satisfaction in having added this important process to ones skillset. Another benefit is that one can do one knife at a time within one's own timeframe.

The benefit of sending the blades out is a proven track record of success, as you point out. There is absolutely nothing wrong about doing this, IMHO, though some feel differently. I personally enjoy the process and the opportunity to learn this fascinating subject. There is no intrinsic reason why a professional heat treater's results will be automatically better than if it is done properly in the home shop.

Just my 2 cents.....

[Drac]

Alex,

The reasons I started HT my blades was the turn around time + the cost of one blade here, one blade there or waiting until I had enough for bulk discounts. I will never get anywhere near Paul's level but at least I'm not waiting 2-3 weeks on blade turn around and time in shipping. I also don't have to pay for shipping or take two more chances for the package becoming lost.

Jim

[John T Wylie Jr]

one thing I hadnt thought of was mentioned to me by a few makers at the Vegas show about using a heat treat oven in the home shop , constant and non fluctuating power source. With all the steps needed to do something such as S30V , what needs to be done in advance so I can assure my power is steady and not fluctuating at all ?

or am I over thinking ?

[fitzo]

I am having a hard time figuring out what the power fluctuations will do? All I can come up with is a brown out or outage would reset the controller processor? Perhaps it's just naivete on my part because we have pretty good electricity delivery where I live.

There's nothing exotic about HTing S30V, BTW. No more so than any other blade stainless, at least. Compare the HT's of blade steels in the datahseets at www.crucibleservice.com

I'd be interested in hearing anything further about the power! Thanks!

[philip bradford]

Alex,

I just purchased an Even Heat oven today. I make very few knives and it is only a hobby for me. The reason I made this purchase is driven by three factors: 1. I like to make knives all at once, waiting two to three weeks for a blade to com back from a heat treater breaks my rhythm; 2. I'm always worried my blade will get lost in transit ; 3. Sole authorship.

I guess there is actually a fourth; knife making isn't an end in it?s self. My real goal is to increase my knowledge and skills with all aspects of metalworking. Heat-treating is probably the single most crucial skill that must be mastered for a knife to perform to the best of its ability. I choose to learn and control that process. You can mess up allot of things and still make a knife perform well; heat treating is not one of them.

By the way, if you decide to go with Even Heat, Tim Zowada has the best prices I could find. There are also allot of post saying complimentary things about him. You?d think he was related to Rob Frink or something.

Good luck.

Philip

[Ray Rogers]

Alex,

In my opinion, professional heat treaters do very good work. In some cases though, you can do better on your own. Do as Fitz suggested and read the HT specs from the steel manufacturers. The first thing that strikes me when I look at the specs for a new stell is how many different ways the manufacturer may suggest to HT the steels. Some methods are fairly simple, some can be quite complex and demanding. Which way do you think the professionals choose to do their blades when they are doing dozens, maybe hundreds per week? Are the complicated methods better? Maybe, sometimes. For instance, S30V can be oil quenched (fair results), plate or air quenched (not so good for me), or interrupted oil quenched followed by a high pressure air quench (Bingo!). But, unless you have your own oven and can test and experiment, you will never really know....

[fitzo]

One additional comment: I would feel naked doing HT at home without my hardness tester. I bought oven and tester at the same time.

[alexkuzn]

Guys,
you convinced me. That was an easy part now I have to convince my wife.

Which oven do you recommend?
I understand two major brands are Paragon and EvenHeat.
EvenHeat is cheaper but its control has only tree buttons control. Can it be programmed for more complex heat treating?

Alex

[fitzo]

They are both very good furnaces. I like the way the Paragon is built a little better (sturdier, IMHO), but there's absolutely nothing wrong with the Evenheat. I have both an old analog Paragon and a recent Evenheat.

The three-button SetPro controller on the Evenheat works ok if you are not easily aggravated by up and down arrows. It has multiple-segment capability and plenty of programmability. Go to evenheat-kiln.com and read the SetPro pdf ( http://www.evenheat-kiln.com/pdf/setpro2005.pdf ). If you want direct entry of the numbers off a full keypad, you can upgrade to a "Rampmaster II" controller, like I did, for about $100. It is exactly the same programming sequence as the SetPro, so you don't gain anything, just punching in "1-9-5-0" instead of scrolling to it.

Personally, I would conserve my bucks, get the Setpro, and put the money towards a Grizzly (or used "ebay") hardness tester.

They say "owning a boat is having a hole in the water to pour money into." Do you get the impression kn ifemaking is the same?

[fitzo]

Alex, I was thinking about this and remembered that you are working in O-1. If you are doing edge-quenched blades, scrap what I said about a hardness tester. It would be of no real use to you in that case.

[Ray Rogers]

Actually Fitz, I find the hardness tester to be very useful on edge quenched blades.....IF you grind the blade after HT like I do....

[fitzo]

Originally Posted by Ray Rogers

Actually Fitz, I find the hardness tester to be very useful on edge quenched blades.....IF you grind the blade after HT like I do....

You got me on that one, Ray! I'll have to test a folder blade if I ever actually make a folder. I remember now you do all your blades that way.

[alexkuzn]

Every time time I buy next piece of equipment I tell my wife that now I practically have everything I need and this is a last piece of equipment
Now it looks like I also do need a hardness tester.

BTW I use O-1 just because it's a good steel and very forgiving. When I feel comfortable I'll definitely switch to stainless steel.

Alex

[fitzo]

Alex, if you used O-1 forever and never tried another steel, you would still be using a great steel. I am a big fan of O-1.

I have been making knives 25 years. I have so much equipment I need to shimmy around sideways in my shop at times. There's still stuff I would like to have.

There is a "sickness" amongst guitar players called GAS (Gear Acquisition Syndrome) that I think knifemakers are susceptible too, also.

It is good thing to have an understanding wife, neh?